Ubuntu Wiki

   1 [15:02] <ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/05/04/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
   2 [15:03] <sabdfl> hello all!
   3 [15:03] <jcastro> ok
   4 [15:03] <jcastro> before we start let me give everyone some tips
   5 [15:03] <jcastro> a) Try to ask something answerable, it's easier than asking questions that are hypothetical
   6 [15:04] <jcastro> b) I'll skip questions that are easily googleable so that people with good questions don't get lost
   7 [15:04] <jcastro> Ok sabdfl, introduce yourself and I'll start when you're ready!
   8 [15:04] <sabdfl> i wholeheartedly agree with (a) :-)
   9 [15:04] <sabdfl> i'm Mark Shuttleworth, and happy to answer any and all questions
  10 [15:05] <sabdfl> especially answerable ones :-)
  11 [15:05] <sabdfl> fire away!
  12 [15:05] <jcastro> QUESTION: Why did you decide to make Ubuntu less customisable (in terms of how it looks, not the lenses, those are great)?
  13 [15:05] <sabdfl> I think you mean Unity, rather than Ubuntu
  14 [15:05] <sabdfl> Ubuntu itself is a superset, has a great deal of customizeability
  15 [15:05] <sabdfl> and many faces - Xubuntu, Kubuntu, Lubuntu etc
  16 [15:06] <sabdfl> with many options across all of them
  17 [15:06] <sabdfl> in Unity, we have a very tight set of options
  18 [15:06] <sabdfl> part of that is because it's a 1.0, and we wanted to focus on the things people will most enjoy, and most need
  19 [15:06] <sabdfl> part of that is because we know every option has a high cost, and not every option is equally used
  20 [15:07] <sabdfl> we also know that the best people to discuss options with are often in a good position to implement them
  21 [15:07] <sabdfl> it's cheap for someone to show up and demand an option, but often they don't stick around for the prototyping, evaluation, discussion, implementation, maintenance
  22 [15:07] <sabdfl> and we have to stick around :-)
  23 [15:07] <sabdfl> as a general meme in design, options are much more expensive than people realise
  24 [15:08] <sabdfl> each option divides the userbase into people who perhaps cannot talk to each other on the phone to help each other through an experience
  25 [15:08] <sabdfl> because they see and do different things
  26 [15:08] <sabdfl> as a developer, you have a LOT of options, some of which involve gconf or dconf or ccsm or patching the code
  27 [15:08] <sabdfl> as an end-user, you are dependent on developers decisions
  28 [15:08] <sabdfl> so, we prioritise the needs of the people for whom we can make the biggest difference
  29 [15:08] <sabdfl> i respect there are other approaches
  30 [15:09] <sabdfl> but i think it's also reasonable to expect respect for the position we take
  31 [15:09] <sabdfl> we certainly have a good and growing community that appreciates those positions
  32 [15:09] <sabdfl> and we'll work with them to make unity even better
  33 [15:09] <sabdfl> not always by adding options, but by testing and deciding what works best
  34 [15:09] <sabdfl> it's also a fallacy that "clever developers need options"
  35 [15:09] <sabdfl> they need robust, usable software just like everyone else
  36 [15:10] <sabdfl> so Unity is as much for developers as end-users
  37 [15:10] <sabdfl> next!
  38 [15:10] <jcastro> QUESTION: Are you statisfied with Unity in the recent Ubuntu version ?
  39 [15:10] <sabdfl> yes, though i recognise there are issues, and i would not be satisfied unless we fixed many of them in 11.10
  40 [15:10] <sabdfl> in the end, when we reviewed bug lists, stability and experience, Unity was the best option for the average user upgrading or installing
  41 [15:11] <sabdfl> there are LOTS of people for whom it isn't the best
  42 [15:11] <sabdfl> but we had to choose a default position
  43 [15:11] <sabdfl> i think we walked that line admirably, i appreciated the open discussion that was had, and it made me more confident in the final position
  44 [15:11] <sabdfl> that decision is best taken by the desktop team, and they were arguing in favour of unity, and they had my support for that
  45 [15:11] <sabdfl> next!
  46 [15:12] <jcastro> QUESTION: will lubuntu become official?
  47 [15:12] <sabdfl> i would like it to, yes
  48 [15:12] <sabdfl> i think the lubuntu team have done excellent work to make sure that it's possible - integrating their processes and output into the main archive
  49 [15:12] <sabdfl> there's a thread on the TB list and I'm behind on mail, we're waiting iirc for comment on tools, like iso testing
  50 [15:13] <sabdfl> from an experience and governance point of view, Lubuntu meets my personal requirements
  51 [15:13] <sabdfl> it has solid leaders, a good track record of delivery, and works in the spirit of Ubuntu
  52 [15:13] <sabdfl> we need to know if there are costs or work to be done on the tools front, but I expect they are manageable
  53 [15:13] <sabdfl> next!
  54 [15:13] <jcastro> Question: When will we see the beautiful Ubuntu monospace font?
  55 [15:13] <sabdfl> this cycle, is my estimate
  56 [15:14] <sabdfl> ask sladen!
  57 [15:14] <sabdfl> but we've given a final view on the basic mono cell structure, now it's design and engineering, and much of the design is done
  58 [15:14] <sabdfl> the engineering is hinting etc
  59 [15:14] <sabdfl> we don't need that for getting it public, so i think there will be a beta soon
  60 [15:14] <sabdfl> paul sladen will have more details
  61 [15:14] <sabdfl> next!
  62 [15:14] <jcastro> QUESTION: what is ubuntu doing to match rolling release model updates (like arch)
  63 [15:15] <sabdfl> i think rolling releases are a very interesting concept
  64 [15:15] <sabdfl> we should discuss this at UDS next week
  65 [15:15] <sabdfl> I know a few distros are embracing the concept
  66 [15:15] <sabdfl> and perhaps it would be appropriate for us too
  67 [15:15] <sabdfl> but i don't have a view, and would be interested to hear opinions, especially the TB
  68 [15:16] <sabdfl> perhaps that will become a standard approach in future for all distros? I would not want us to be behind :-)
  69 [15:16] <sabdfl> next!
  70 [15:16] <jcastro> QUESTION: Hi Mark. How much of a threat is the recent Google patent infringement suit to Canonical, Ubuntu and Linux in general?
  71 [15:16] <jcastro> http://www.engadget.com/2011/04/21/google-ordered-to-pay-5-million-in-linux-patent-infringement-su/
  72 [15:16] <sabdfl> interesting question
  73 [15:16] <sabdfl> just to clarify - it's not Google that's filing suit, it's another company suing big users of Linux
  74 [15:17] <sabdfl> the case has the hallmarks of a quick-and-dirty job, it was filed in a jurisdiction that very typically finds for patent plaintiffs without necessarily really understanding the issues
  75 [15:17] <sabdfl> there appear to be some obvious inconsistencies and problems in the suit, which will get addressed in appeal
  76 [15:17] <sabdfl> and there are related suits, which may undermine the basis of that suit at all
  77 [15:17] <sabdfl> patents are a steaming mess that stifle innovation, rather than supporting it
  78 [15:18] <sabdfl> and in order to change the system, we need mainstream recognition of that
  79 [15:18] <sabdfl> right not, major tech companies all play both sides of this
  80 [15:18] <sabdfl> and they have enough patents in their armories to get by that way
  81 [15:18] <sabdfl> but it's getting crazy even for them
  82 [15:18] <sabdfl> this is one reason why I prefer GPLv3 to v2, it has a nice "calming the waters" effect on patents
  83 [15:19] <sabdfl> which I think few people have really understood
  84 [15:19] <sabdfl> when this really gets crazy, the majors will be pushing FOR v3, not against it :-)
  85 [15:19] <sabdfl> anyhow, I'm not worried about this particular judgment
  86 [15:19] <sabdfl> next!
  87 [15:19] <jcastro> QUESTION: Is the windicators idea completely forgotten? What happened with that?
  88 [15:20] <sabdfl> patches welcome. i think it is needed to fill out the vision, but it's also not critical for *right now* so it's always just fallen off the list for the core team
  89 [15:20] <sabdfl> now we have a growing team of contributors to Unity, perhaps this will get taken on
  90 [15:20] <sabdfl> it should be really straightforward!
  91 [15:20] <sabdfl> next!
  92 [15:20] <jcastro> Question: Hi Mark The pace of change in Ubuntu seems to be getting faster and faster in adopting new ideas and themes. Do you have a future target date to ease up. Or onward ever onward?
  93 [15:20] <sabdfl> well, part of the reason to embrace hard change now was to allow the 12.04 LTS cycle to be more polish and refinement than big-change
  94 [15:20] <sabdfl> beyond that, onward ever upward
  95 [15:21] <sabdfl> we've always tried to make small improvements where we can
  96 [15:21] <sabdfl> not always successfully or brilliantly
  97 [15:21] <sabdfl> but you learn a lot about software if you get all the bug reports, and we certainly are in that position
  98 [15:21] <sabdfl> so it's in my view frustrating for people to argue that Ubuntu is in no position to contribute to the user experience, and that work should "all be done upstream"
  99 [15:22] <sabdfl> upstream often doesn't want to slog through the bug reports :-)
 100 [15:22] <sabdfl> what's changing, is that we're growing our capacity in Ubuntu (and in Canonical) to build credible views on the sorts of changes we think may help, and to implement them
 101 [15:22] <sabdfl> and as a result, the number and scope of those changes is definitely increasing
 102 [15:22] <sabdfl> i don't think that's a change in policy, just a change in capacity
 103 [15:23] <sabdfl> but i recognise it's caught people off guard, as that's crossed a threshold of publicity
 104 [15:23] <sabdfl> not everything we do will turn out to be perfect
 105 [15:23] <sabdfl> but as I said, we're in the position that we see, daily, how people actually use and enjoy (or not) the software
 106 [15:23] <sabdfl> so we're in a credible position to participate
 107 [15:23] <sabdfl> next!
 108 [15:23] <jcastro> QUESTION: How does Ubuntu plan to take advantage of the new offerings of GNOME3, in terms of new approaches or new User Experience. Unity was huge, and that was before GNOME3. What potential improvements are waiting on GNOME3?
 109 [15:24] <sabdfl> i'm looking forward ot having all of GNOME3 in Ubuntu
 110 [15:24] <sabdfl> and I think we'll achieve that in Oneiric
 111 [15:24] <sabdfl> it's certainly a hot topic on the agenda for UDS next week
 112 [15:24] <sabdfl> I also think there continue to be lots of areas of collaboration between work done in GNOME, and Unity, and elsewhere
 113 [15:24] <sabdfl> our default position is to try and make that happen
 114 [15:25] <sabdfl> but also to be willing to go in the direction we think will give end users the best experience, based on evidence
 115 [15:25] <sabdfl> you will certainly be able to have a close-to-vanilla GNOME3 experience in 11.10, and the deltas will be for good reason
 116 [15:26] <sabdfl> contrary to popular belief, even distros that claim to be vanilla, often carry a lot of patches
 117 [15:26] <sabdfl> so i feel that gnome-in-ubuntu will be faithfully conveyed
 118 [15:26] <sabdfl> and there's a great part of the Ubuntu community that cares about that and is invested in making it happen
 119 [15:26] <sabdfl> that's why we have a GNOME3 PPA today
 120 [15:26] <sabdfl> next!
 121 [15:26] <jcastro> QUESTION : What is the criteria for choosing the default applications in ubuntu?
 122 [15:27] <sabdfl> i think i blogged about this when talking about bringing Qt in as a toolkit
 123 === me is now known as Guest48089
 124 [15:27] <sabdfl> maybe someone can dig up that URL?
 125 [15:27] <sabdfl> in there are the criteria I think matter: user experience, and consistency are both on the list
 126 [15:27] <sabdfl> relationship to Ubuntu and the rest of the apps in Ubuntu-by-default matter too
 127 [15:27] <jcastro>   http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/568
 128 [15:28] <sabdfl> because we can always do the best work where we have the best relationships
 129 [15:28] <sabdfl> collaboration is so much easier
 130 [15:28] <sabdfl> at the end of the day, we want anyone who chooses Ubuntu to feel they got the best experience as a result
 131 [15:28] <sabdfl> this is a very, very tough process every UDS
 132 [15:28] <sabdfl> I don't always agree with the result
 133 [15:29] <sabdfl> but  I respect the process the desktop team (and Kubuntu team and server team) run to make those decisions
 134 [15:29] <sabdfl> and i feel good that pretty much every other option is just an apt-get away
 135 [15:29] <sabdfl> next!
 136 [15:29] <jcastro> QUESTION: how difficult will it be to get overlay scrollbars in 100% of the applications?  right now, the implementation seems to be pretty spotty.  any guestimation on what release will see overlay scrollbars in all applications?
 137 [15:30] <sabdfl> this depends on two things: broadening the overlay-scrollbar API, and hooking it into more toolkits
 138 [15:30] <sabdfl> we're seeing progress on both fronts
 139 [15:30] <sabdfl> part of the rationale for pressing GO in 11.04 was to make the gaps obvious to the audience of developers who can help close them
 140 [15:30] <sabdfl> Cimi has already had quite a few emails from developers asking how they can make the scrollbars work in their apps
 141 [15:31] <sabdfl> so i think it will see active development
 142 [15:31] <sabdfl> i was surprised that we got Firefox, Thunderbird and OpenOffice working with the global menu in 11.04
 143 [15:31] <sabdfl> it all came together because folk stepped up
 144 [15:31] <sabdfl> same is true of scrollbars
 145 [15:31] <sabdfl> so, help wanted and welcome
 146 [15:31] <sabdfl> next!
 147 [15:31] <jcastro> QUESTION: Do you believe in abstract nicks Mark?
 148 [15:32] <sabdfl> it's not something i question on a daily basis :-)
 149 === same is now known as sergioam
 150 [15:32] <sabdfl> within Canonical, I'm in the "you should pick a nick you like, not FirstnameLastname" camp
 151 [15:32] <sabdfl> next!
 152 [15:32] <jcastro> QUESTION: What are your feelings about the growing number of indicators in the top panel?
 153 [15:32] <sabdfl> i spent a lot of time studying screenshots of people's desktops
 154 [15:33] <sabdfl> i asked folk to send them to me
 155 [15:33] <sabdfl> and some media picked up on that
 156 [15:33] <sabdfl> so i got thousands!
 157 [15:33] <sabdfl> they were very interesting
 158 [15:33] <sabdfl> people put a LOT of stuff in their panel
 159 [15:33] <sabdfl> and partly, the fact that people can do that is something they love
 160 [15:33] <sabdfl> so we have to find a balance
 161 [15:33] <sabdfl> we want the panel to be crisp and clean and useful
 162 [15:33] <sabdfl> which implies fewer icons, and less use of colour, and more MEANINGFUL use of colour
 163 [15:34] <sabdfl> you should be able to glance at the panel and quickly see if there's something which needs your attention
 164 [15:34] <sabdfl> once you can do that, you resent having to stare at it to understand it
 165 [15:34] <sabdfl> so we have category indicators, and will make more of the system indicators into category indicators, to encourage individual tools and apps to fit inside them
 166 [15:35] <sabdfl> thus reducing the number of icons and improving people's ability to understand roughly what's going on in their system
 167 [15:35] <sabdfl> but
 168 [15:35] <sabdfl> if an app or tool really doesn't fit in a category, it's fine for it to be alone on the panel
 169 [15:35] <sabdfl> as an appindicator
 170 [15:35] <sabdfl> i don't think that's cool, if it's just "to have my icon on the panel"
 171 [15:36] <sabdfl> because users most often have no idea what "all those icons" are for, and adding to the problem is not cool!
 172 [15:36] <sabdfl> so if there's a category that works, it should be used
 173 [15:36] <sabdfl> if there really isn't, use an appindicator
 174 [15:36] <sabdfl> next!
 175 [15:36] <jcastro> QUESTION: Are there any plans for more mainstream Ubuntu preinstalls from big name vendors? Currently, I believe only HP and Dell offer a small selection of Ubuntu laptops.
 176 [15:37] <sabdfl> i would not be here today if I didn't think we could get to a world where all the vendors sell free software based machines with Ubuntu on 'em
 177 [15:37] <sabdfl> so yes, there are plans, and credible expectations
 178 [15:37] <sabdfl> next!
 179 [15:37] <jcastro> Question: Will 11.10 cross the limit of 1 CD release?
 180 [15:37] <sabdfl> it's a very good discipline, so no
 181 [15:37] <sabdfl> next!
 182 [15:37] <jcastro> QUESTION: Hi Mr. Mark, When can we see WAYLAND in UBUNTU.
 183 [15:37] <sabdfl> i think you mean "when will it be the default display system"
 184 [15:37] <sabdfl> and the answer is "green"
 185 [15:38] <sabdfl> i think wayland is the most likely basis for future displays across most linux devices
 186 [15:38] <sabdfl> i think it will take the longest of all to get that on the desktop
 187 [15:38] <sabdfl> or something like that
 188 [15:38] <sabdfl> before that, it will happen in particular form factors and devices
 189 [15:38] <sabdfl> maybe a specialised netbook here or there
 190 [15:38] <sabdfl> or ARM smartbook
 191 [15:38] <sabdfl> next!
 192 [15:38] <jcastro> QUESTION: Will there be mainstream advertising, such as commercials, billboards, etc.  in Ubuntu's future?
 193 [15:39] <sabdfl> possibly, though it's not likely to be the most effective way to reach consumers for us, for a long time
 194 [15:39] <sabdfl> next!
 195 [15:39] <jcastro> QUESTION: When oh when can I get my ARM laptop running Ubuntu with an everlasting battery playing HD content?
 196 [15:39] <sabdfl> the everlasting bit is tricky
 197 [15:39] <sabdfl> but "all day long", within 12 months imo
 198 [15:39] <sabdfl> next!
 199 [15:40] <jcastro> QUESTION: what was being in space like?
 200 [15:40] <jcastro> (haven't had a space question in a few years!)
 201 [15:40] <sabdfl> magical
 202 [15:40] <sabdfl> really magical
 203 [15:40] <sabdfl> and one of my crew mates is waiting in Florida for them to fix the shuttle so he can fly again, lucky guy
 204 [15:40] <sabdfl> i was in Russia for the 50th anniversary of Gagarin's flight
 205 [15:41] <sabdfl> it was amazing - and i think with hindsight, the friendships i made in the experience were the best bit
 206 [15:41] <sabdfl> though i would love to fly again, perhaps further
 207 [15:41] <sabdfl> next!
 208 [15:41] <jcastro> A question from Jason De Rose, one of the upstreams to the Novacut editor:
 209 [15:41] <jcastro> QUESTION: any thoughts on how best to push for high quality *open* GPU/APU drivers? are hardware manufactures warming up? for certain workloads (like video editing), the GPU has become extremely important... any advice how, say, a startup developing a video editor could start a productive dialog with hardware mfrs?
 210 [15:41] <sabdfl> the main thing, i believe, is to have the vendors REALLY care about Linux
 211 [15:41] <sabdfl> once that's true, they become more and more susceptible to doing things the linux-friendly way, which is always as open source
 212 [15:42] <sabdfl> if it's a small part of their concerns, they try to find the easiest / cheapest way to check the box
 213 [15:42] <sabdfl> even that might not be easy or cheap
 214 [15:42] <sabdfl> so i'm grateful that, broadly speaking, ATI, nVidia and Intel all take Linux seriously
 215 [15:42] <sabdfl> we should not take that for granted
 216 [15:42] <sabdfl> i'm embarrassed when I see a rant attacking ATI or nVidia for not just doing what "the community wants"
 217 [15:42] <sabdfl> that's not how life goes, in my experience
 218 [15:43] <sabdfl> we need to be more relevant, in more markets
 219 [15:43] <sabdfl> that's why we focus on user experience, so we can have end-users demanding Ubuntu, so in turn we can move up the charts in the hardware vendors minds
 220 [15:43] <sabdfl> next!
 221 [15:43] <jcastro>  QUESTION : for all this development of ubuntu you need lots of people, in what area would yo usay you have plenty and where do you really need more involvement?
 222 [15:43] <sabdfl> wow
 223 [15:43] <sabdfl> i think we need more involvement in core apps
 224 [15:43] <sabdfl> to raise the quality of experience
 225 [15:44] <sabdfl> we've been focusing on Unity, because that's the starting point
 226 [15:44] <sabdfl> but libreoffice, firefox, evolution, thunderbird, and many more all need love!
 227 === Donna is now known as Guest59476
 228 [15:44] <sabdfl> next
 229 [15:44] <jcastro> QUESTION: is Ubuntu profitable yet?  If not, any ideas on when it will be?
 230 [15:45] <sabdfl> no, and while we have projections which are grounds for confidence, there are also reasons to continue to push the investment faster than it would grow organically
 231 [15:45] <sabdfl> next
 232 [15:45] <jcastro> QUESTION: do u prefer iphone or android?
 233 [15:45] <sabdfl> iphone!
 234 [15:45] <sabdfl> next
 235 [15:45] <jcastro> Saamm: Ubuntu Mono font.  It's currently in design steps needed for moving to beta for the beta team, or more generally (unhinted).  If that's all good it can be hinted for final release on  http://font.ubuntu.com/  Webfonts and Ubuntu 11.10 this cycle.
 236 [15:46] <jcastro> For those wondering (from Paul Sladen)
 237 [15:46] <sabdfl> awesome, thanks jcastro, sladen
 238 [15:46] <jcastro> QUESTION: Will we ever get some concrete numbers of numbers of deployed Ubuntu desktops? (aside from the hard to track ones)
 239 [15:46] <sabdfl> i don't think we could get this even if we added some sort of registration
 240 [15:46] <sabdfl> and if we added registration, lots of users would have reservations
 241 [15:46] <sabdfl> so it's unknowable, and trying too hard to know would hurt!
 242 [15:46] <sabdfl> i think it's many, many millions
 243 [15:47] <sabdfl> we can see for example, in wikimedia's browser stats
 244 [15:47] <sabdfl> it's still only a tiny start on the world of computing
 245 [15:47] <sabdfl> but i think we will make a much bigger dent in time
 246 [15:47] <sabdfl> next!
 247 [15:47] <jcastro> QUESTION: Will Indicator API improved this cycle like missing tool tips and many other things?
 248 [15:47] <sabdfl> the absence of tooltips is a design decision, not an API issue
 249 [15:47] <sabdfl> iirc, the content for the tooltips is actually passed in the API
 250 [15:48] <sabdfl> but we don't display it
 251 [15:48] <sabdfl> the reasons are that more often than not, tooltips end up being more harmful than helpful
 252 [15:48] <sabdfl> if you read code which has lots of tooltips, you'll see
 253 [15:48] <sabdfl> most of them are unneeded
 254 [15:48] <sabdfl> often that are flat out wrong
 255 [15:49] <sabdfl> and it's almost impossible to make them look stylish
 256 [15:49] <sabdfl> so, it's better to say to developers "put more time into the design of your *visible* UI, rather than trying to paper over it with *invisible* tooltips
 257 [15:49] <sabdfl> i understand that's a surprising position to some
 258 [15:49] <sabdfl> but it's backed up by real research and experience
 259 [15:49] <sabdfl> next!
 260 [15:49] <jcastro> QUESTION: What work is being done to make inclusion in USC for 3rd party devs as "easy" (read: well documented) as Android / Apple marketplaces?
 261 [15:50] <sabdfl> this is MPT's area of expertise, with the app review board process and various tools being setup to support it
 262 [15:50] <sabdfl> i'm not up to speed, but perhaps he can be persuaded to shed some light
 263 [15:50] <sabdfl> next!
 264 [15:50] <jcastro> QUESTION: Will the Unity 2D launcher get transperant <---- this might be a good time just to explain what you want to see in 2d for 11.10
 265 [15:51] <sabdfl> i think the need for 2D is to support chips which don't do 3D
 266 [15:51] <jcastro> (and/or give us any tidbits/juicy news on what you want to do for 11.10, as we're running short on time now)
 267 [15:51] <sabdfl> and typically, they also do not do compositing
 268 [15:51] <sabdfl> which is the transparency bit
 269 [15:51] <sabdfl> so, I don't think so
 270 [15:51] <sabdfl> but I may be wrong
 271 [15:51] <sabdfl> i'm really impressed with the unity-2d work
 272 [15:52] <sabdfl> if I'd known it would come together so well, we could have planned to get it into 11.04
 273 [15:52] <sabdfl> kudos to the folk who lead it, and the community that's growing up around Unity
 274 [15:52] <sabdfl> next!
 275 [15:52] <jcastro> QUESTION: ConnMan will replace network-manager-applet on 11.10?
 276 [15:52] <ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
 277 [15:52] <sabdfl> this falls into the "I don't have unilateral say on app selection" question, I think
 278 [15:53] <sabdfl> I believe ConnMan has some really important capabilities
 279 [15:53] <sabdfl> and we should give it serious consideration
 280 [15:53] <sabdfl> we would be the first to deploy it very widely, which means the first to run into lots of issues
 281 [15:53] <sabdfl> Google are adopting a (fork/branch) of it for Chrome OS
 282 [15:53] <sabdfl> but it's not ready YET, imo, to be the default
 283 [15:54] <sabdfl> I'd like it to be parallel installable easily, perhaps we can get there for 11.10
 284 [15:54] <sabdfl> help wanted!
 285 [15:54] <sabdfl> next
 286 [15:54] <jcastro> QUESTION: Have there been any Unity design decisions that you think will be revisited now that users have had a chance to use it and respond?
 287 [15:54] <sabdfl> oh yes
 288 [15:54] <sabdfl> there's lots to learn, that can only be learned in reasonable time by getting code into a wide deployment
 289 [15:55] <sabdfl> some decisions I regret and we'll evaluate alternatives, some we'll tweak
 290 [15:55] <sabdfl> it's by no means perfect, and it would be egotistical to suggest otherwise
 291 [15:55] <sabdfl> so everything is on the cards
 292 [15:55] <sabdfl> that said, i think the bulk of it has worked out fantastically
 293 [15:55] <sabdfl> both at an engineering level (compiz, nux) and in the user experience
 294 [15:56] <sabdfl> i'm proud of the guts required by quite a few people to commit to delivery, and the effort that went into it, and the support we've had from so many
 295 [15:56] <sabdfl> it's reassuring that others are following the broad design
 296 [15:56] <sabdfl> and we'll work out the details in round two :-)
 297 [15:56] <sabdfl> next!
 298 [15:56] <jcastro> QUESTION: With the benefit of hindsight, if you could change one thing about Ubuntu since its inception, what would it be?
 299 [15:56] <jcastro> last one!
 300 [15:56] <sabdfl> great question
 301 [15:57] <sabdfl> of course, we can change anything, so this is not a meaningless question
 302 [15:57] <ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
 303 [15:57] <sabdfl> i think i would have been clearer about the need for us to have the capacity to implement change
 304 [15:57] <sabdfl> i think if we'd done that from the start, some things would be easier
 305 [15:58] <sabdfl> people would have made fewer accusations of "not contributing", because those who only measure that kind of contribution would have been able to see them from the start
 306 [15:58] <sabdfl> on the other hand, we would have established our willingness and ability to lead as well as follow at the start, which would feel like less of a change now
 307 [15:59] <sabdfl> and perhaps, folk would have been more willing to be collaborative, if that capacity had started before Ubuntu became such a substantial player
 308 [15:59] <sabdfl> i fear that, today, many of these conversations are hugely influenced by competitive dynamics
 309 [15:59] <sabdfl> probably, both ways
 310 [15:59] <sabdfl> nevertheless, here we are
 311 [16:00] <jcastro> Awesome, well thanks for stopping by and answering user questions, I'm sure we'll have plenty of things for next time to talk about 11.10.
 312 [16:00] <sabdfl> we have an *amazing* community, which I think reflects the combination of values, governance and willingness to get the work done efficiently
 313 [16:00] <sabdfl> people want to participate in a place where their contribution will have the biggest impact on the most people
 314 [16:00] <sabdfl> and i think Ubuntu is one such place
 315 [16:00] <sabdfl> thank you!
 316 [16:00] <jcastro> Thanks everyone for contributing questions to this session, now we move on to doctormo, thanks sabdfl!
 317 [16:00] <sabdfl> thanks jorge for the stewardship of the classroom :-)_