EpiphanyDefaultBrowser
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| This page is an open discussion about whether or not to consider Epiphany as a default browser instead of Firefox. The proposed switch to Epiphany is not suggested for the Breezy Badger release, but is aimed at Breezy+1. |
##(see the SpecSpec for an explanation) |
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| '''Note''': This page is not endorsed by any Ubuntu developer and is only an open discussion. There is no official plan to replace Firefox by Epiphany. | * '''Launchpad Entry''': https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/epiphany-default-browser * '''Created''': <<Date(2006-04-19T13:11:54Z)>> by LionelDricot * '''Contributors''': LionelDricot * '''Packages affected''': |
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| '''Note''': This is also not a discussion about what features should be added to Epiphany or Firefox. | == Summary == |
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| == What must be a default browser ? == | This spec is intended to track whether or not it is worth changing the default Ubuntu browser from Firefox to Epiphany and, if yes, what must be improved and/or changed in Epiphany. |
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| A default browser must be simple enough and doesn't need a lot of features by default. (to complete) |
== Rationale == As we ship GNOME, it seems logical, in order to have a more consistent environment, to ship GNOME browser, namely Epiphany. Having the default GNOME browser would simplify a lot of things in the long run : security, support, translation, desktop integration, artwork. Also, Epiphany is more or less independant of the backend engine. If, in a not so distant future, anyone release another html engine, Epiphany could be ported in order to use it. The use of the name and logo for "Epiphany" is somewhat less complicated than it is for Firefox. Given that now Epiphany can be compiled against XUL-runner (see http://blogs.gnome.org/view/epiphany/2005/11/20/0 ) and that Edgy is all about taking some risks, it's *the* release to test Epiphany as the default browser. If it's a disaster, we could always back to firefox on Edgy+1 == Use cases == * Arthur has no computer experience. His friend installed Ubuntu and he wants to "surf the web" like everyone is saying. He look for something named "surf the web". He expect it to be simple to learn and to use. * Zaphod has little Windows experience. He knows that internet is the little blue icon named explorer. His friend, who installed Ubuntu, told him that, in Ubuntu, it's called "browser". Zaphod want his browser as simple and easy as the old explorer. * Trillian is an advanced user. She likes to install Firefox on new Windows systems. She wants to install Firefox on her new Ubuntu system but she wants to do it herself because "Firefox is only for supreme power users like me and I like the feeling of installing it where average users don't even know about it !". This is also a good way to learn how to install software on Ubuntu. * Marvin is a non-technical user but he likes to surf the web. He doesn't want to learn technical thing but he heard about "extensions to block popups", "extensions to blocks ads", "rss syndication". He wants to use that but without learning more than "where must I check the corresponding box ?". == Scope == This spec is only for Ubuntu and all Gnome Ubuntu derivatives. == Design == == Implementation == === Code === === Data preservation and migration === * If you are using Firefox in Dapper and you are upgrading to Edgy, will you be forced to use Epiphany unless you explicitly say it otherwise? Or, to the contrary, only fresh install of Edgy will show the difference. * There must be a simple way (druid?) to import cookies, history, bookmarks, passwords from Firefox to Epiphany. ''Schalken: It appears that if your using Epiphany with Firefox's Gecko backend, then Firefox and Epiphany will share their cookies, history and homepage, at least. Assuming the rest is stored in text files, writing a script to transfer bookmarks and passwords between browsers would not be difficult.'' *''jacobmp92: In the latest Firefox/Epiphany setup, Epiphany appears to use its own bookmarks, history, cookies, cache, etc. Bookmarks from Firefox can be imported via File > Import on the Bookmarks window.'' == Outstanding issues == * Firefox has its own RSS managment. In epiphany we have four options: 1. Disable the RSS extension by default 2. Enable the RSS extension and install a compatible RSS reader by default (liferea) 3. Create an extension to handle RSS the way Firefox does 4. Create a separate "epiphany-rss" package that depends on liferea (which should also use XUL-runner as a backend), thus making RSS support both optional and simple to install. * Tabs suddenly disappear in a scary way in Epiphany, not very friendly to newbies or power users. That's a showstopper as far as I'm concerned. * https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gtk+2.0/+bug/30749 * http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=330676 * http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=124068 * An Unofficial extension called "Only One Close Button" at http://www.sstuhr.dk/epiphany-extensions/ fixes this, but also removes each tab's close button, which is probably not desired. * I've written an extension which does the same as OOCB but doesn't take away the close button. http://code.predius.org/ephy/ * The Tab Sizer extension has an interesting solution, as well, which resizes tabs to fit all of them on screen, such that the farther away ones are the smallest. However, the problem you mention is a problem in GTK, and should really not be tampered with by weird hacks. GTK's currently unfriendly tab bar should also not be a negative for choosing Epiphany at the default, but actually a big positive. Firefox does not use that tab bar, but one which looks and behaves completely differently. For a user still getting used to the desktop, that is an unnacceptable situation! Widgets such as the tab bar in the web browser should behave just like every other tab bar on the desktop, whether GTK currently has it right or not. The great thing about using the native UI toolkit is that this can change without Epiphany having to do any further work. As soon as GTK has a smooth tab bar, Epiphany has a smooth tab bar. Going back to Firefox, or Opera, on the other hand, if GTK's tab bar was to become significantly different from the norm, Firefox would be permanently left behind while every other tab bar on the desktop behaves in the new way. For the less knowledgeable user, this is confusing. For the more knowledgeable user, this is ugly. Consistent GUI behaviour, whether that behaviour beats another GUI or not, should always win over default applications whose behaviours and toolkits are out of place from the rest of the desktop. -- DylanMccall <<DateTime(2007-10-21T03:27:23Z)>> |
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| == What think the average Joe user about Epihany or Firefox ? == | == BoF agenda and discussion == |
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| Most of average users don't care at all. In fact, they don't see any difference if you ask them. | A lot of discussions is available here : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EpiphanyDefaultBrowserThoughts |
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== In favor of Epiphany as the default == * Epiphany is well integrated with GNOME and follows the global theme and global options (like displaying text beside buttons, GNOME proxy settings, etc). * Epiphany follows the GNOME release schedule making it easier to synchronize new releases of Epiphany with new releases of Ubuntu. * Epiphany's tab handling is generally better than Firefox's (although this is set to change when Firefox 1.5 arrives, and is improved by some Firefox extensions) * Epiphany has "session saving" built in - which means that if for some reason it does crash, it will ask "do you want to restore you previously open pages" when restarting. Although there is a Firefox extensions that does this, it is not installed by default. * Epiphany follows the GNOME Human Interface Guidelines which helps it feel more consistent with the rest of the GNOME desktop. For example, the preferences dialog uses tabs and takes a more simple approach than that of Firefox. * Epiphany seems to use less RAM, possibly because it utilizes GTK+ without the overhead of XUL. Lower resource requirements are important to keep in mind when trying to gain marketshare in countries where older computers are more common. * Translations are easier because of Epiphany's I10n support. * Epiphany adheres to freedesktop .org bookmarks standards (XBEL), which is also used in Galeon, Konqueror and some other browsers. There is a firefox "Bookmark Synchroniser" plugin that can import/export to this format. * Bookmarks can be imported from Firefox/Mozilla, Galeon, or Epiphany to make retaining bookmarks easy. They can exported to Firefox/Mozilla if the user decides to use Firefox instead. * On middle-config (between 600MHz and 1GHz), Epiphany is much faster and doesn't eat 100% of CPU when an adress is not responding == In favor of Firefox as the default == * Firefox is well known and has lots of "hype" * Better handling when you have lot of tabs (see [http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=153792 Epi bug #153792]) * Having Firefox will help ease transition for users of Windows and MacOS, as Firefox is available on those platforms. However, Firefox has a few interface differences between platforms which can confuse users who expect Firefox on Windows to be identical to Firefox on Linux. (e.g. "Preferences" menu entry is under "Tools" in Windows but it is under "Edit" in Linux, clicking the URL entry area once in Windows selects all text but clicking once in Linux does not, etc.) * Firefox extensions make it easy for users to really personalize their browser for a better surfing experience. Even if Epiphany currently has its ''epiphany-extensions'' package, Firefox has some widely-installed extensions that Epiphany has no equivalent for (yet). The most commonly referred-to one is Adblock - although Epiphany has a plan for an equivalent http://live.gnome.org/Epiphany_2fAdBlockExtension ''(This is, IMHO, not an argument since it's only a power user tool. You cannot provide by default a browser that alter the web like AdBlock! So, the extension is not to be installed by default and must not be considered, like many extensions, as an argument. Same apply to webdev extension (wich is very cool, but is a no necessity for the Average Joe) or the Gmail Notifier (which is only useful if you do use Gmail).)'' == General points == * Firefox contains more "power user" features, which could be argued as a good point by both sides. * Firefox supports keywords in the address bar "google search term" (use google to search for "search term") or "dict word" (to look up "word" in an online dictionary), whereas in Epiphany "keymarks / smart bookmarks" appear as a dropdown menu from the address bar. * Firefox has a search field in the toolbar, which can be configured to use different search engines. In Epiphany any 'smark bookmark' can be put into the bookmark bar, which creates an entry field - this allows users to have boxes for dictionary lookup, babelfish translation, etc. == Outstanding issues with Epiphany == * Epiphany currently depends on the Firefox packages, so to run Epiphany, Firefox needs to be installed. This could be dealt with by creating a seperate Gecko package, on which Firefox, Epiphany, Galeon, Mozilla, Thunderbird and all other Gecko-powered applications would depend on. == Related Links == * Epiphany-Firefox comparison on Epiphany site http://live.gnome.org/Epiphany_2fFirefoxComparision * "Should Firefox be the default Gnome browser"? http://live.gnome.org/Epiphany_2fFrequentlyAskedQuestions#head-ba622057b4fb0e671c16b6d9868912f8af22bec0 |
* CelsoPinto: Choosing Epiphany as the default browser is a good thing because Epiphany supports ZeroConf bookmarks and Ubuntu is moving towards ZeroConf everywhere. ---- CategorySpec |
Launchpad Entry: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/epiphany-default-browser
Created: 2006-04-19 by LionelDricot
Contributors: LionelDricot
Packages affected:
Summary
This spec is intended to track whether or not it is worth changing the default Ubuntu browser from Firefox to Epiphany and, if yes, what must be improved and/or changed in Epiphany.
Rationale
As we ship GNOME, it seems logical, in order to have a more consistent environment, to ship GNOME browser, namely Epiphany.
Having the default GNOME browser would simplify a lot of things in the long run : security, support, translation, desktop integration, artwork. Also, Epiphany is more or less independant of the backend engine. If, in a not so distant future, anyone release another html engine, Epiphany could be ported in order to use it. The use of the name and logo for "Epiphany" is somewhat less complicated than it is for Firefox.
Given that now Epiphany can be compiled against XUL-runner (see http://blogs.gnome.org/view/epiphany/2005/11/20/0 ) and that Edgy is all about taking some risks, it's *the* release to test Epiphany as the default browser. If it's a disaster, we could always back to firefox on Edgy+1
Use cases
- Arthur has no computer experience. His friend installed Ubuntu and he wants to "surf the web" like everyone is saying. He look for something named "surf the web". He expect it to be simple to learn and to use.
- Zaphod has little Windows experience. He knows that internet is the little blue icon named explorer. His friend, who installed Ubuntu, told him that, in Ubuntu, it's called "browser". Zaphod want his browser as simple and easy as the old explorer.
- Trillian is an advanced user. She likes to install Firefox on new Windows systems. She wants to install Firefox on her new Ubuntu system but she wants to do it herself because "Firefox is only for supreme power users like me and I like the feeling of installing it where average users don't even know about it !". This is also a good way to learn how to install software on Ubuntu.
- Marvin is a non-technical user but he likes to surf the web. He doesn't want to learn technical thing but he heard about "extensions to block popups", "extensions to blocks ads", "rss syndication". He wants to use that but without learning more than "where must I check the corresponding box ?".
Scope
This spec is only for Ubuntu and all Gnome Ubuntu derivatives.
Design
Implementation
Code
Data preservation and migration
- If you are using Firefox in Dapper and you are upgrading to Edgy, will you be forced to use Epiphany unless you explicitly say it otherwise? Or, to the contrary, only fresh install of Edgy will show the difference.
There must be a simple way (druid?) to import cookies, history, bookmarks, passwords from Firefox to Epiphany. Schalken: It appears that if your using Epiphany with Firefox's Gecko backend, then Firefox and Epiphany will share their cookies, history and homepage, at least. Assuming the rest is stored in text files, writing a script to transfer bookmarks and passwords between browsers would not be difficult.
jacobmp92: In the latest Firefox/Epiphany setup, Epiphany appears to use its own bookmarks, history, cookies, cache, etc. Bookmarks from Firefox can be imported via File > Import on the Bookmarks window.
Outstanding issues
- Firefox has its own RSS managment. In epiphany we have four options:
- Disable the RSS extension by default
- Enable the RSS extension and install a compatible RSS reader by default (liferea)
- Create an extension to handle RSS the way Firefox does
- Create a separate "epiphany-rss" package that depends on liferea (which should also use XUL-runner as a backend), thus making RSS support both optional and simple to install.
- Tabs suddenly disappear in a scary way in Epiphany, not very friendly to newbies or power users. That's a showstopper as far as I'm concerned.
https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gtk+2.0/+bug/30749
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=124068
An Unofficial extension called "Only One Close Button" at http://www.sstuhr.dk/epiphany-extensions/ fixes this, but also removes each tab's close button, which is probably not desired.
I've written an extension which does the same as OOCB but doesn't take away the close button. http://code.predius.org/ephy/
The Tab Sizer extension has an interesting solution, as well, which resizes tabs to fit all of them on screen, such that the farther away ones are the smallest. However, the problem you mention is a problem in GTK, and should really not be tampered with by weird hacks. GTK's currently unfriendly tab bar should also not be a negative for choosing Epiphany at the default, but actually a big positive. Firefox does not use that tab bar, but one which looks and behaves completely differently. For a user still getting used to the desktop, that is an unnacceptable situation! Widgets such as the tab bar in the web browser should behave just like every other tab bar on the desktop, whether GTK currently has it right or not. The great thing about using the native UI toolkit is that this can change without Epiphany having to do any further work. As soon as GTK has a smooth tab bar, Epiphany has a smooth tab bar. Going back to Firefox, or Opera, on the other hand, if GTK's tab bar was to become significantly different from the norm, Firefox would be permanently left behind while every other tab bar on the desktop behaves in the new way. For the less knowledgeable user, this is confusing. For the more knowledgeable user, this is ugly. Consistent GUI behaviour, whether that behaviour beats another GUI or not, should always win over default applications whose behaviours and toolkits are out of place from the rest of the desktop. -- DylanMccall 2007-10-21 03:27:23
BoF agenda and discussion
A lot of discussions is available here : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EpiphanyDefaultBrowserThoughts
* CelsoPinto: Choosing Epiphany as the default browser is a good thing because Epiphany supports ZeroConf bookmarks and Ubuntu is moving towards ZeroConf everywhere.
EpiphanyDefaultBrowser (last edited 2008-08-06 16:20:54 by localhost)